Hardt Biocybernaut and binaural neurofeedback training

DavidM.DavidM.
edited November 2015 in Software
Hello i am David,

At the Moment i have a PNeurobics 4 Ch Device and an 32 Ch EEG Unit, 2 Weeks ago i have found this Project on the Internet, and i think its a great and modern EEG, something that i was searching for over 2 Years

The Hardware it great and easy to use but i want to do Neurofeedback with this Device, for that at the Moment is no Software on the Market that i can buy, i want to do this Training with the Device:


The Training Steps of the Alpha training are exactly prescribed, so i want to ask the Community if someone could withe the exact same software for the Open BCI Unit, I will use this software it only for my private use

Best regards David form Italy

 

Comments

  • wjcroftwjcroft Mount Shasta, CA
    David, hi.

    If you use the Pocket-Neurobics with Bioexplorer or BioEra, (VPLs, Visual Programming Languages) this is easy to do. Although James Hardt has seemingly apparently 'patented' this approach, it's very related to prior art in the field. Checkout the patents by Carter et al. The basic idea is to measure what is called the Dominant Frequency, and then reflect that back to the user in various ways. It's been used by other systems such as Len Ochs' Flexyx, LENS. HPN is also using this idea. Hardt has added the idea of modulating with binaural beats, but that seems so obvious.

    The VPLs generally have an element block to measure Dominant Frequency with some constraints (e.g. within a given bandpass). You would then wire the output of that element through an expression evaluator that creates two audio frequencies. For example 300 Hz and 300 Hz + D.F. These frequencies are inputs to two audio oscillators that go to left and right ears. This idea can also be used to drive LED goggles at the D.F. flash rate (what Ochs' Flexyx did).

    BioEra does have a driver for OpenBCI. Bioexplorer currently does not, and will likely not in the future.

    Neuromore is free and has an OpenBCI driver, but does not currently drive PN or your 32 ch amp. I think Neuromore has the D.F. element. It does have expression evaluators. Then you just need the signal generator / audio oscillator. Neuromore can also drive OSC (Open Sound Controller) outputs, so I'm sure there are OSC tools that can generate sine wave tones.

    William

  • DavidM.DavidM.
    Hello, 

    thanks for your Answer,

    after i have found the Website of Dave Asprey, i am really interested to do this Program at home,

    what do you think ,how many Hours of work it would take to bing a Training Program like this together?

    Best Regards David
  • wjcroftwjcroft Mount Shasta, CA
    edited November 2015
    It only takes about an hour to setup a Bioexplorer design to do this.

    re: claims by Asprey and Hardt (Biocybernaut training for $10,000) of "40 years of Zen" in one week and "50% increase in Creativity and an 11.7 point increase in IQ". 

    There is considerable skepticism in the field of neurofeedback practitioners I'm in contact with -- remarking that Hardt's claims are over the top.


    As you can also see from the course descriptions on that page, there is much more involved than just the neurofeedback aspect alone. Various group processes and testing, etc.
  • DavidM.DavidM.
    i understand that its not only just the training that they do, its the complete  Forgiveness process, 

    he describes it in this Video : 

    yes the pricing of the Training is way to high, but i have watched some Videos of Dave Asprey and he has don 10 Weeks ! of this Program, and its one of the nicest Persons i knew, so far....

    because of this i am really interested to expand my Training Program, at the Moment i have only a 2 Ch Alpha Session from the (for me Specialized) Training Program in the Bioexplorer


  • wjcroftwjcroft Mount Shasta, CA
    edited November 2015
    Asprey likely gets free or discounted sessions from Hardt, because Asprey has a referral program with Hardt, that Asprey calls "40 years of Zen".

    http://40yearsofzen.com/optin

    Is Asprey's marketing "over the top"? Dave's podcast interviews are great, but the marketing emphasis for his own products is a turn off for some.

    https://www.bulletproofexec.com/bulletproof-radio-episodes-directory/

  • wjcroftwjcroft Mount Shasta, CA
    edited November 2015
    David, I just listened to the part 1 and 2 of the Hardt interview with Lilou Mace. Thanks for that link, guess this came out in January this year, had not seen it. Quite interesting. No mention there really of the binaural aspect. But this paper (and the others below) does mention the lab setup:


    They use a 4 channel setup with O1 O2 C3 and C4, all simultaneously monitoring alpha levels. Each channel has it's own tone whose volume represents the alpha amplitude. The tones are even located on speakers in the 4 corners of the small room, corresponding to the channel locations. He uses very sharp bandpass filter for the alpha band (8-12 hz), sharper than a typical Butterworth order 3 or 4, which has very rounded band rolloff. Originally he was using custom analog filters for this, then went to digital. But I think they are still in hardware(?), digital filters. Raising the order substantially on software digital filters (as in a VPL such as BIoexplorer) will also increase the filter phase delay. Hardt says his filters are very sharp and fast in the video. 

    More references,



  • wjcroftwjcroft Mount Shasta, CA
    edited November 2015
    http://www.biocybernaut.com/alpha-training/

    So apparently on the 1st level of training, they use those 4 channels mentioned previously. Then as the levels go up (if you take more weeks), they add simultaneous feedback on other channel pairs, T3 T4 F3 F4. So now 8 channels, they even go up to 12 channels. Probably adding P3 P4, maybe Fp1 Fp2, not sure it's not stated.

    In addition to the separate tone per channel amplitude feedback, they also add in feedback on left right coherence on various channel pairs, to reward more left right hemisphere synchrony. Wild.

    I'm not sure what that would sound like with 12 or more different tones all going on at once. Perhaps they only work with 4 or 8 separate tones at once, switching off which 10-20 EEG head sites they are assigned to.

    The patent you mentioned on your first post is only one of many that Hardt has filed. I think his use of binaural dominant frequency feedback may be reserved for higher levels of his training sequence. May not even be used in his initial week. If one can make inferences from what has been published.


  • DavidM.DavidM.
    Thanks for the great answers, and for the References,

    since some Months Dave Asprey has his own "Biohacking Labs" next to his House,

     with some Tools to increase Human Performance, there he has also 2, 40Years Of Zen, EEG Machines

    He says that is more or less the same as you can do in Hadt s Training,

    i have asked him what EEG he is using, he uses the Brainmaster 24 Ch EEG, i believe with the Brain Avatar Software, because this Software is most used with this Device

    But the Problem is that the Software and the EEG of this Brans costs together something around 15.000 $ 

    Do you think, some parts with this Training will be possible with an other EEG for example with the Open BCI, or only with the Brainmaster EEG?
     
  • wjcroftwjcroft Mount Shasta, CA
    David, yes. It's very straightforward to do amplitude training on mulitple channels. Tying the EEG amplitude to volume of tones, different frequency tones per channel. I see on some of the photos online of the Biocybernaut amplifiers, they do 8 channels at once. (Perhaps after they work up starting at 4 ch.) C3 C4 O1 O2 T3 T4 F3 F4. Easy to do this with OpenBCI 8 channels.

    Since you already have a 32 ch amp, why not use that. What manufacturer?

  • DavidM.DavidM.
    The 32 Ch EEG that i have is from the Manufacturer: NNC, Model: Nation 7128W-E32
    The Reason why i have bought this EEG is because it was the only Model i could find on the Market with an Fiberglass transmission, because initially i had some Problems with the PN Device with some interactions of the Signal

    The Problem now is that i have a Software for the EEG that is working, but with this i cant do Neurofeedback, 
    i have already asked the Support form Bioexplorer if he can write me a Software so that i can use the NNC with the Bio Explorer, but he has never answered my Mail....

    Do you think it will be a lot of work to write a Software for the Device, or you you think it will be cheaper to buy an other EEG, unfortunately i have now a new EEG but i cant really use it 
  • wjcroftwjcroft Mount Shasta, CA
    The downside to buying from China is the tech support. As well as the fact that many manufacturers are secretive about their device usb protocols. I assume you have tried contacting them and asking for the details of the usb commands and data. Some manufacturers will supply a library (DLL) that exposes functions that can receive the data.

    Another approach is to decode the usb protocol yourself, as was done here, but this takes substantial skill,

    http://doc.ml.tu-berlin.de/bbci/publications/VenBla12.pdf

    Larry @ Bioexplorer is somewhat notorious for not answering emails. But in this case it may be justified because you have no protocol specs. My advise would be just use the PN equipment you have, that's 4 channels and quite good. It's what Pete recommends at Brain-Trainer.com . It works out of the box with Bioexplorer.

    It may be likely that Hardt only trains 4 of the 8 channels at a time. All of his online papers only mention 4 channels. You can clearly do a lot with just that. Possibly try to return your Nation EEG box if you can. Or sell it on eBay to some clinic or hospital that can use it.

  • DavidM.DavidM.
    I have now contacted the Supplier of the 32 Ch EEG System, if they can send me the DLL File, 

    at the moment i think its really the easiest Solution to use the PN Device with the Bioexplorer

    The last thing that i need is someone who can write me a Program for the Bioexplorer where i can do this Alpha training, only for Home use

    if someone could do that i, would really appreciate  it 

    again @wjcroft for the great Support and for answering my Questions, Great Forum
  • wjcroftwjcroft Mount Shasta, CA
    You should have some Bioexplorer example designs already that you can look at. It's a simple signal flow idea. The element blocks at the far left of the design are the raw data coming in from the channels, one per channel. You would then wire each channel to a separate Filter element, 8-12 hz for the alpha band. There are two outputs from the Filter: amplitude or signal. You want the amplitude which represents how many microvolts of alpha are present from moment to moment.

    Each of the 4 amplitudes are then wired to 4 Threshold objects. I'm pretty sure Hardt is using fixed thresholds, not auto. His papers make a point of that. This means that after every training epoch (see the papers, every few minutes), you will readjust the manual thresholds to be in the desired range.

    Finally the output of the Thresholds goes to 4 Midi objects, such that the amplitude of the alpha connects to the Volume input of the Midi. There is one of the Threshold outputs that will give you that gradation rather than a simple on off. Select the Midi to be a continuous wave type such as an organ tone, rather than a piano. I would use a diatonic scale, so the tones form a pleasing chord, such as C4 E4 G4 C5, etc.

    You'll also want some oscilloscope and trend graphs to monitor what is going on with the raw eeg and amplitudes over time. Spectrogram is also good to look at. I usually have both a short term and long term trend line so I can monitor how the session is progressing.

    Here's an example of how a volume modulated alpha reward is done in BrainBay. Similar principle to what you'll do in Bioexplorer,

    https://sites.google.com/site/biofeedbackpages/brainbay-openbci/brainbay2


  • AliceAlice AZ
    edited September 2025

    I know this is an old thread but @DavidM. where you able to get your setup??

    I’m looking into getting one myself and would love any insights. Thank you!!

  • AliceAlice AZ

    @wjcroft would you perhaps be able to help?
    Thanks!!

  • wjcroftwjcroft Mount Shasta, CA

    There are MANY consumer grade neurofeedback setups available now. Most of which use an accompanying phone app. This Youtube channel reviews many of them. Creator is a Navy trained MD psychiatrist, now specializing in brain training.

    https://www.youtube.com/@CodyRallMD/videos

    [more recent reviews on the link aboe]

    https://techforpsych.com/

    James Hardt's training is out-of-this-world expensive. Last I heard it was over $10K for a week. Claims overblown frankly. Watch some of Cody's material for down to earth reviews.

    There are open source neurofeedback apps available for OpenBCI boards. See this page:

    https://docs.openbci.com/Software/CompatibleThirdPartySoftware/BrainBay/
    https://docs.openbci.com/Software/CompatibleThirdPartySoftware/Neuromore/

    But the off the shelf consumer headsets with matching phone apps, are generally easier to use, no programming required.

    William

  • AliceAlice AZ

    Thanks sooooo much for your response!!!

    Great find with Cody Rall. Love what he’s doing. From that video though, the only device that could maybe come closer would be the https://sens.ai/
    I’m just a bit skeptical in the results…

    Agreed, Hardt’s training is out of this world expensive- at a whooping 22k a week. But the results, even though not as exaggerated as advertised, are legit. I attached his book. He explains some of the process there.

    I’m really hoping I can set my own EEG neurofeedback at home. But is that just not realistic?

    Thanks again!!!!

  • wjcroftwjcroft Mount Shasta, CA

    You inserted about FOUR copies of that last post. I guess you were trying to append the book pdf. I already have the physical book and pdf. There are reviews online of Hardt's program. And Dave Asprey's spin off "40 Years of Zen" (ridiculous marketing babble). There is no 'instant substitute' for a regular spiritual practice. Even Rall states that.

    https://40yearsofzen.com/ [Asprey is the ultimate huckster]

    Cody reviews a huge range of consumer brain training devices. I assume you watched more than just the '2024 Brain Tech' review. That video was recorded about 2 years ago in October 2023. Many more recent videos in his feed.

    Hardt's protocol and training is entirely proprietary. Not enough details are given in the book to replicate. Book was published in 2007, 18 years ago. Almost certainly there have been refinements since then.

    Watch Rall's videos on Peak Alpha Training (raising the center average alpha frequency). The nominal band is from 8 to 12 Hz, with the center being at 10 Hz. However high achievers tend to have a bit higher center frequency. And it appears this can be trained up with Muse and other devices.

    Paradoxically, long time meditators tend to have a LOWER alpha peak, below 10 Hz. This might correlate with some of their mind states of equanimity, compassion, forgiveness, etc.

  • AliceAlice AZ

    Yeah, apologies. I was trying to attach the book and didn’t realize it was posting every time :|

    I attended Biocybernaut’s Alpha 1 and checked into 40yearsofzen before deciding on Biocybernaut. I can’t however spend that kind of money again. That was a one off I was able to scrape by.

    I’m not looking for a substitute to a meditation practice, but a compliment. I’ve been meditating for 20 years (on and off) and Biocybernaut’s experience was profound. So of course I’m looking to continue but with a more accessible price tag.

    I used to own a Muse and it basically did nothing. Although to be fair, that was the 2019 version. I see they completely changed the hardware now. I might have to give that a try.
    I was just hoping to get close to the ‘real deal’. I know Hardt’s tech is proprietary but your convo with David here sounded very promising.

    I also inquired with https://www.holonexperience.com/about-neurofeedback in hopes that they are reasonable. Was really hoping for a good home setup though. Hardt’s training real value, at least for me, was in the actual neurofeedback. I considered the time with the trainer mostly fluff to be honest…

  • wjcroftwjcroft Mount Shasta, CA

    You might want to check out Dr. Jeff Tarrant's Neuromeditation Institute, which offers various trainings. Several Forum threads here mention Jeff's work. This one has some videos and links to his sites.

    https://openbci.com/forum/index.php?p=/discussion/2642/implementing-jeff-tarrants-neuromeditation-focus-protocol

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