Neurofeedback for ADHD
Hello. I am looking for a cost effective way to help resolve ADHD issues - for most members of a family. Is there any specific software / Hardware combination that is proven for this?
Thanks for your time
Martin
Hello. I am looking for a cost effective way to help resolve ADHD issues - for most members of a family. Is there any specific software / Hardware combination that is proven for this?
Thanks for your time
Martin
Comments
Pete Van Deusen's protocol suite. Will support OpenBCI devices sometime this fall using the BioEra app. Already has support (and has for some years) for various devices using Bioexplorer app.
https://brain-trainer.com/
Advantage of Pete's system is that you are not "shooting in the dark", a quantitative assessment is done prior to starting your neurofeedback, to find the best match in the available protocols.
https://brain-trainer.com/about/trainers-q/
Regards, William
Hi!
The scientific consens (for the moment) is to follow two Neurofeedback protocols. These two, are the only ones which showed proven efficacy in randomized controlled trials. Theta/Beta protocol or Slow-cortical potentials.
With the Openbci you will only be able to do the Theta/beta training. (down training Theta and up regulating beta).
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27238063
SCP is possible on Cyton, as it is DC coupled. Some of us are doing variations of ILF protocols using the app BioEra. The gold standard for ILF / ISF is the work of Siegfried and Sue Othmer (Cygnet ILF), and Mark Smith (ISF, on Brainmaster).
SCP differs from ILF protocols, in that it rewards for training in certain directions and sequencing. ILF is just feeding back activity, which alone resets various central nervous system dynamics. Both SCP and ILF are working with the glial support network in the brain.
Thanks. While I am a software developer and I know a number of languages - I'm really looking for something that I could get working right now with the Open BCI hardware - and some software. I looked into the brain-trainer stuff befoer posting here and mentioned the open BCI hardware but they did not mantion anything about that specifically.
Is there any sotware which will enable me to achieve Theta / Beta & SCP potentials?
@Wjcroft, cool that DC recording is possible with Cyton, since i have a ganglion i did not know that.
@Martyhtheman, for the theta /beta protocol, you can use/adapt the focus widget of the Openbci software. I additionally like openvibe or bioera.
edit: this thread might help https://openbci.com/forum/index.php?p=/discussion/2346/neurotechedu-neurofeedback-tutorial-would-it-work-with-cyton#latest
Marty, hi.
BrainBay is what is called a VPL, Visual Programming Language. You connect function blocks via on screen 'wires' that transmit EEG data, filtering, thresholds, feedback, etc. Other VPLs are BioEra, OpenViBE, National Instruments LabVIEW, etc.
https://sites.google.com/site/biofeedbackpages/brainbay-openbci
Theta / beta ratio could be done easily with BrainBay. Pete is not announcing the availability of his BioEra protocol suite until it is complete. Estimated this fall.
William
Please note that neurofeedback is best done, when you have some kind of assessment procedure to best determine the proper protocols and site locations to train.
In addition to the theta/beta neurofeedback training, and SCP / ILF (Slow Cortical Potentials / Infra-Low Frequency) neurofeedback for ADHD -- here is yet another protocol that seems to stabilize ADHD. It works by increasing the amount of alpha generated, which stabilizes other aspects of the central nervous system, especially in those with low levels of endogenous alpha.
Paradoxically, this protocol works by DOWNTRAINING alpha during the session. Then alpha REBOUNDS post session to levels more in alignment with normal levels. So after a number of downtraining sessions, the baseline alpha should be increased over the long term.
https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/689398v1
https://www.biorxiv.org/content/biorxiv/early/2019/07/02/689398.full.pdf
The previous BrainBay tutorial link given in the comments, could be used for training down alpha. Or training up alpha, you decide how you interpret the feedback sound (your intention during the session whether to increase or decrease).
Regards, William
Thanks William.. really appreciate all this feedback.
@wjcroft: You mentioned Cyton is DC coupled and some people are doing ILF. Would you clarify whether ILF requires a DC-coupled amp? I have a Ganglion (which I believe is not DC coupled). I have BioEra and would like to see anyone's ILF/SCP designs for Ganglion that may like to share them.
@Paski the study you referenced showed a lack of proof for NFB efficacy in ADHD. Similarly, a newer study from 2017: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28803030.
Elliot, hi.
Thanks for your links. Here is the ISNR comprehensive bibliography,
https://www.isnr.org/isnr-comprehensive-bibliography
As you might guess, bias with which scientists approach a subject area, can influence the results they obtain. EVEN if the studies are framed as randomized controlled trials. The consciousness and (even unconscious) intentions of the investigators, does permeate out into the experiments and results. There are far too many successful applications of neurofeedback (for all conditions) to write it off as unproven or sham / placebo effects.
Even if theta/beta ratio training may not be the most optimal approach, there are many many different protocols being investigated and explored.
Ganglion is NOT DC-coupled. So is not the best platform for ILF. The experts in ILF/ISF, the Othmer's and Mark Smith, use proprietary systems and protocols. Thus the details of their protocols are not publicly available. There are several related threads on the forum here discussing ILF. Use the search button in the upper right.
Regards, William
I am also sure it is the case, that any practitioner using neurofeedback with ADHD, is also employing the entire range of suggested strategies, and not just limiting themselves to neurofeedback alone. Frequently there are synergies. The blinded study you mention most likely was careful to AVOID any other simultaneous approaches.
Hi Elliot, the Meta-analysis which i atached, showed that there is a significant improvement of ADHD core symptoms, nevetheless only when parents (not blinded) raters rated the symptoms. Further, they recomended standard protocols (Theta/Beta, SMR and SCP) which reached significance also for blinded raters (Teachers).
Here is a newer study https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28408873, which controlled for a lot of unspecific effects...And it is the largest study to date with ADHD children.
The Study of Schöneberg, is with adults, and it has some important shortcomings, such as the training/learning techniques.
Best,
Pascal.